NaRon Tillman

[00:00:00] Speaker A: Welcome back, listeners, to the Tron podcast. This is your host, Rashad Woods. Today I have a very good honor and privilege today to be able to talk to a multifaceted, multi talented individual who does ministry, as well as an author, a business owner, digital strategist and entrepreneur. Mr. Naran Tillman. Thank you very much, very much. Appreciate you. [00:00:17] Speaker B: Thank you, Rashad, for having me. I really appreciate you and your listeners for sitting and taking out the time to listen to my little old story. [00:00:27] Speaker A: But you know, first of all, kind of what we talked about previously, you have a very interesting dichotomy where number one, you know, you're a servant and you obviously have your own, you're a minister as well, too. So. And then you do business as well as automate processes and AI. And to be honest with you, I don't think of that as like, you know, very two divergent kind of, you know, things that you do, but you marry them together real well. Please tell us about yourself. [00:00:49] Speaker B: Just to add so that the whole book can make sense too. I teach mindfulness and yoga. I started business first. I always been an entrepreneur since 19, 20 years old. When you get close to 50, all of those years start to merge together. In a few weeks I'll be 50. So it was around that age, yeah, that I got into, into my first business, which was construction. I started preaching when I was 24 and at first I segmented ministry and business. And as I grew older, I realized that this was all a part of who I am. And now I have the ability to, to take the ministry lessons, the business lessons and what I know about neuroscience, mindfulness and movement and bring them all together as a, as a blend. And it affords me to have a unique perspective on not just life, but teaching. [00:01:39] Speaker A: Okay. You know, and what I thought was fascinating was all your, your Instagrams and all of your postings and social media posts are obviously very positivity driven. And you know, you have your own company, Principal Matters as well too. Can you please go deeper in what that company is? [00:01:53] Speaker B: Principal Matter is our podcast production company. Well, it's a production company, period. And it turned into a podcast production because we produce podcasts. [00:02:03] Speaker A: Okay. [00:02:04] Speaker B: It started, it was supposed to be a music company, but as I started to grow in the podcast business, we started producing podcasts through the production company. The name of our podcast is Walking Victory. Principally Matter is, is the, is the parent holding company for the. For Walk in Victory. We also have One Ministries podcast and Lawrence and I have a podcast why and how online where we have discussions about how people should use digital. Their digital blueprint. [00:02:36] Speaker A: Yes. [00:02:37] Speaker B: In today's fast paced, fast moving AI economy. [00:02:40] Speaker C: Right. [00:02:41] Speaker A: Well, I thought what was fascinating particularly about you is the one thing that you emphasize is use of time and automating processes. Right. Because a lot of times people, especially in this new era, you know, are concerned about being replaced or concerned about being displaced or being quote unquote left behind. But you utilize it to maximize your time. And you've done a very good job of saying, listen, you know, you're big on automation and obviously, you know, you do repeatable strategies as well too. So how did you find out to use AI as a tool with the things that you do? [00:03:10] Speaker B: I grew frustrated with, with AI. I had chat GPT for a while and I was, I was sitting at, I was sitting on the, I was looking at it, I was like, I don't understand. I had the dolly and I. And I'm reading all these articles and everybody's so pumped up about it and I'm like, I don't see it, I don't get it. I didn't understand prompt engineering. And one of my friends, he's younger, younger pastor, and he's like, oh man, all you have to do is this. So he started to show me a little bit. And me, I'm a student, I'm always going to be studying. And I just started diving into prompt engineering and I saw this, this synergy between prompt engineering and the subconscious mind. The way that we prompt our subconscious mind for a purpose or prosperity or whatever, whatever we want to prompt it for, it could be even for a bad day. Because the way that we, the way that we put the prompts into our subconscious is the output that we're going to get. So when we wake up in the morning, we say, I'm tired, you're going to be tired. You wake up in the morning and say, today's going to be a long day. Although it's 24 hours, seven days in the same day and week, it's going to feel like a longer day. No hours change. It was just the mindset. So the book that I wrote is Awakening I Am and it'll be out this fall. And in this inner awareness in a digital age. Yeah. And we really dive into the similarities between prompt engineering. The more vague the prompts, the vague the output, the more distinctive we prompt. The more distinctive the output, the more vague we talk to ourselves in our subconscious mind, whether it's through prayer or affirmations, whatever floats your boat, the more Vague the outputs, the more clear, clearer we are in who we are becoming the subconscious mind. Just like the AI wants to give us our desires. It just take the subconscious mind some time. Whereas AI, it can really happen fast. [00:05:07] Speaker A: Do you ever find though sometimes with artificial intelligence, for all of its pluses, I mean, we all like to be able to access information readily and in front of us, but it's almost turned everybody into a subject matter expert. Right. So now is, do you view it as like, and I say this respectfully because obviously you're in ministry and you've worked very hard to get where you are that now people can, you know, if they want to quote, unquote, find something quickly, they access it quickly and they haven't done all of their back end research to be able to talk about it in depth. I mean, it's good that people have that information in front of them, but at the same time it can't be a substitute for continuous learning. [00:05:43] Speaker B: No, it can't be a substitute for continuous learning. But what we can say wholeheartedly is that if you're in any, an end user and you don't know about your topic, manner is not going to make you smarter. It's only going to enhance what it is that you know. Because, because again, it goes to the prompt. If you don't really know about marketing, it's not going to make you a marketing agent. It's going to help you to be mediocre, a better mediocre version of a market. [00:06:09] Speaker C: Right, right. [00:06:10] Speaker B: The thing is, and this is my stance and this is why I think that writing this book was important. I grew up Pentecostal and I'll be 50 again. When I was coming up, TV, movies, everything was a sin. So I've, I've grown up, grown up through an era where I've watched religious institutions reject technology only to have to circle back around to embrace it. Pre Covid, we had ministers and ministries, same. Facebook was the devil. Right. And, and these were real worldviews and thought patterns and processes. Now everybody had to embrace it and we see a lot of people not doing it well. [00:06:50] Speaker C: Right. [00:06:51] Speaker B: And having Facebook is not an online ministry, but that's a whole nother. Whole nother. My thought here is. And you can follow me and interject my thought here is we're living at the foundation of this evolution. Many of us missed the dot com boom and we sat on the sidelines and became users of, of the technology instead of looking at it as a way to foster innovation. [00:07:22] Speaker A: Absolutely. [00:07:22] Speaker B: Innovation. [00:07:23] Speaker C: Right. [00:07:24] Speaker B: And you can't beat something up if you don't have a voice in it. So if you want to be, you want to be a leader in it, if you want to have your voice heard, then learn it while it's being done so that you can carve out a space where we can have conversations centered around how to use AI for. [00:07:41] Speaker A: The future and for the future and. [00:07:43] Speaker B: And not just for business. Gent gently. How can we have our voice? Whether I'm a Buddhist or Christian, how can my voice be heard in the middle of this, this, this new evolution? [00:07:53] Speaker A: Well, what I thought was funny was, you know, and to your point, while when, you know, when YouTube first came out, right. So I'm a user of YouTube. [00:08:02] Speaker C: Right. [00:08:03] Speaker A: And then next thing you know, we. [00:08:04] Speaker B: Got a little freeze here. [00:08:05] Speaker A: We're looking at it from a business standpoint. They're the ones that are trying to elevate it and, and, and monetize it. And that was in 2005 when this. [00:08:13] Speaker B: Plat, well, he's coming back. He thought something was funny. [00:08:16] Speaker A: It's the most washly wide widely. [00:08:19] Speaker B: This happens often, I'm pretty sure cable. [00:08:21] Speaker A: And all the other. [00:08:23] Speaker B: There you go. [00:08:23] Speaker C: Right. [00:08:24] Speaker A: And so I, I apologize. I'll edit that part out if you didn't. [00:08:27] Speaker B: Yes. I was saying, I'm pretty sure you edited out. So you're saying you thought was funny. [00:08:31] Speaker A: What you thought was funny. What I thought was funny was, you know, here is YouTube, you know, this platform that comes out brand new and some people look at it, oh, this fancy toy I can watch all my, I can listen to. You know, some people look at it as a toy or they look at it as. I can watch this whole cartoon episode. But then the brains and people who are trying to make money off it, like, oh, this is, they're already thinking 10 years ahead, you know, and now it's the most mildly most watched, you know, television or streaming platform of all of them. [00:08:57] Speaker C: Right. [00:08:58] Speaker A: What those people who are looking at AI 5 years ago already were thinking of it as a business. [00:09:03] Speaker B: And that's why I'm saying we have an opportunity to be at the forefront. You're going to have to have. If you already have an audience, we're going to need people that think like us, that look like us, that act like us to understand the technology so that we can go and tell the people that think like us, that look like us how to use it safely. You're going to have your bad actors and everything, of course, but just because someone who's learned it and understood it and used it to enhance their character. Doesn't mean that we should not embrace it. There's going to be millionaires created in this, in this, in this evolution. And then there's going to be people that sat on the sideline complain and three years from now they're going to wonder how did they live without it. [00:09:45] Speaker A: Did you see like how some of the engineers that are getting poached right now, the salaries that they're getting, they're getting offered. Yeah. Billions of dollars, my goodness. And you're like, I mean. But I do have a question and you know, just to stay on this topic briefly. You always see and it happens all the time, there's always an over correction and then there's a comeback to earth kind of moment when everybody goes all in on a brand new technology. Just like streaming, perfect example of Stream, everybody got a streaming app. [00:10:14] Speaker C: Right. [00:10:14] Speaker A: Because it was all this is brand new. And then you find out oh they have to merge. Oh they have to, you know, I mean Disney has infinite but even Disney cutback to be able to start realizing that they had to get their cost structure in order. Right. And then so do you find that in, you know, there's going to be a real high and then there's going to be a comeback to earth kind. [00:10:33] Speaker B: Of so to speak, like in anything. If you look at it right now, we have such a fight to a call to action from all of the leaders that they're putting out bad products. [00:10:43] Speaker C: Right. [00:10:44] Speaker B: And smaller companies who are taking their time and being themselves the true I am itself. Right. Are putting out better products than the leaders because they're competing against each other. And you can't create wealth through competition. Wealth is created through creation. And the better we are at creating, that's how come these, these AI leaders are being poached. Because they're actually spending time in creation mode. Right, right. And they're seeing past whatever limitations and they're, and they're pushing the envelope whereas someone else is trying to copy what they're creating to be a trend and you can't be in that. And treads don't last. [00:11:22] Speaker A: And two, because when AI first came out, you know, it wasn't a large leading company that was leading the forefront of. So you have layers of these multi layered companies like a Google that may have had a large structure to get approval to get through something and meanwhile, you know, chatgpt because it's one guy with the vision in his head, he can just hey, I'm going to take the risk and make this work. And meanwhile, it has to go through vp, strategist, team, executive, CEO, has to sign off on it. So it could take a year and a half before it finally says, hey, guys. [00:11:52] Speaker B: And now it's too late. [00:11:53] Speaker C: Now. [00:11:54] Speaker B: Now you're too late. Because what happens is when, when, when a person falls in love with a brand or a product, I don't care who comes next. Even if that was a brand or a product that you loved before, people usually stick with the devil that they know. [00:12:08] Speaker A: Of course. Of course. [00:12:09] Speaker B: Like the rollout of Chat GPT5. Chat GPT5 is faster, it's stronger, it got a better suit. But everybody, like the old Superman chat, people's like, hey, what are you doing? [00:12:22] Speaker C: Right? [00:12:22] Speaker B: We didn't ask for this. We wanted to stay where we were at. And this is the, the era, this is where we're going to be living at, right? Things that we know today is going to not be the same tomorrow. And that's going to be in medicine. Yes, that's going to be in, in ministry. That's going to be in music. Everything that we see today, it has an expiration date. [00:12:40] Speaker A: How do you find that, that this industry at this forefront of technology, what kept you to embrace it, particularly when you said some of your peers did not embrace it? And I say this respectfully in ministry because. Only because, you know, I grew up in church, right. And so it's very in person, it's very studying, you know, your religious text, whatever you come from. And I say that respectfully and it's, it's very personal. So what made you embrace technology with some of your peers and no disrespect to them. [00:13:07] Speaker B: Well, again, I've always been in business. And one of the ways to stay relevant, not to be Blockbuster, but to be on Netflix, is to look at what's happening in front of you. [00:13:17] Speaker A: I did a college paper on that actually once too. [00:13:21] Speaker B: I wrote a whole. [00:13:22] Speaker A: And Netflix offered to sell themselves to Blockbuster and Blockbuster declined. [00:13:27] Speaker B: Declined. Yeah, because just like me, what I'm saying to people right now, I grew up in and I pastored a traditional church. Now I do mainly ministry online. What I say to people right now is the money that you've invested, now this is just to ministries, the money that you would have invested in the music department, because we love our music. You take that budget and you invest it into a media team, including someone in AI. [00:13:51] Speaker A: Yeah, that makes sense. [00:13:53] Speaker B: Because other than that, you're not going to be relevant if you don't have a serp, if you don't have a digital blueprint, you're not going to be relevant. [00:13:59] Speaker C: Right. [00:14:00] Speaker B: And, and now with the way that AI is, AI search is totally different. People are using chat GG chat GPT to look at your particular content and they're, they're making purchases through there now. They're doing everything now like Google. So it's a different kind of search, just other than ranking high in Google SEO. And, and there's a lot to go behind it. You want to be at the forefront of it, of course, because you're going to have lessons that are outdated, certifications that are not keeping up. So every morning I get emails about new and latest technologies just so that I can stay in the loop. Will I use them all? No. Will I understand them all? No. But as long as I understand what's happening. And the worst thing that we can be, especially if we're geared to be the head and not to tell, is to constantly be the tail. [00:14:55] Speaker A: For sure? For sure. 100. Absolutely. [00:14:57] Speaker B: You know, and we, we say that over the head and not the tail. So we supposed to be at the table helping to innovate some of these products, right? Goods and services. [00:15:07] Speaker C: Right. [00:15:08] Speaker B: Our fingerprints should be in the financial sector. Our fingerprint should be in the, in the streaming sector. Our fingerprint should be all over. But we're so passive and, and so scared and we so locked into our small communities that that's all we see. [00:15:23] Speaker C: Right? [00:15:23] Speaker B: My mindset was to have the biggest church in Brooklyn now. [00:15:26] Speaker C: Right. [00:15:27] Speaker B: I have a global reach. [00:15:28] Speaker C: Right. [00:15:28] Speaker A: I always thought it was funny. And one quote that stuck with me is people utilize all these services, you know, whether it's Facebook, whether it's YouTube, all these other social media platforms. And a quote always stuck with me. He said, if it's free, you're not the customer, you're the product being sold. And you're just like, oh, my gosh. So here you are to your point, being on the consuming end of it. Oh, I get to use my Instagram, I get to use my Facebook, I get to use my YouTube. And it's all free, right? It's all. Literally, you are being sold every single time you. I mean, they're monetizing you and you don't even know it. You're so accustomed to just using it as this fun tool to watch clips and entertain yourself that you don't even understand that somebody right now is making a boatload of money off you. [00:16:07] Speaker B: And that's a great point. And let's, let's push that point even further a few Months ago, Facebook changed their algorithm. [00:16:14] Speaker A: Yes, it did. [00:16:15] Speaker B: And now the lives are only going to be housed on Facebook for 30 days. So for ministry does their lives. And if, if you, if you have had all this content and now they're saying, hey, as of this day, you're not going to be able to have access to this content no more. And you don't have the tools to download the content. [00:16:33] Speaker C: Right, Right. [00:16:35] Speaker B: And you don't have the wherewithal, how to use the content. [00:16:38] Speaker C: Right. [00:16:39] Speaker B: I saw threads and posts. People. Oh, they're going to get the. See, this is what I'm talking about. The devil. Like, that's not the devil. You're just not basic economics. Yeah. [00:16:50] Speaker A: You're not basic economics. [00:16:53] Speaker B: You're not educating yourself on how to take your content when you use those streaming platforms, when you use those Facebook or Instagram platforms, you use it as a tool to get a person to your platform. [00:17:06] Speaker A: Correct. [00:17:06] Speaker B: Where you control with your ecosystem. [00:17:09] Speaker A: Absolutely. [00:17:10] Speaker B: And understanding that automation is, is available to us, but automation is not AI. How can I now take AI and enhance those things that are automated. [00:17:20] Speaker C: Right. [00:17:21] Speaker B: And continue to push myself to the forefront. [00:17:24] Speaker C: Right. [00:17:25] Speaker B: Of the conversation? [00:17:26] Speaker A: Do you find a generational difference? Like, if you wanted to bring in, you know, I know there's, there's data that shows that younger people are less likely to go to church or go to a place of worship. And have you found out that that has been a assisted tool to be able to get people to get into your doors or stream onto your services? Have you found. [00:17:43] Speaker B: I don't even invite people to stream because they don't. I don't invite people to stream on those services. I don't invite people. I have a handful of people that I'm training. [00:17:51] Speaker A: Okay, okay. [00:17:53] Speaker B: But I do see that people notice. [00:17:56] Speaker A: Okay. [00:17:57] Speaker B: I can walk down the street, people go like, oh, I saw your clip. [00:17:59] Speaker A: Okay. Okay. [00:18:00] Speaker B: You're always. This. What I. This right here. You're always online. Where can I, where can I come to? But I strategically. Don't. Don't do that yet. [00:18:07] Speaker A: Okay. [00:18:08] Speaker B: Because I'm doing. I want to see something. [00:18:10] Speaker C: Okay. [00:18:12] Speaker B: But think about it. Who creates more content than ministries? [00:18:15] Speaker A: That's a very good question. [00:18:17] Speaker B: Because if you, if you do a Sunday morning service and the average service is about an hour and a half to two hours. [00:18:22] Speaker A: Yes, it is. [00:18:23] Speaker B: You have two hours of content that you've created. [00:18:26] Speaker A: Yes, you do. [00:18:27] Speaker B: The average viewership for a clip is 30 seconds to a minute. That one sermon, that one service, you can do three clips a day for seven days. You can do three different blogs. [00:18:39] Speaker C: Oh, wow. [00:18:40] Speaker B: You can dominate in the religious slash educational. [00:18:44] Speaker C: Right. [00:18:44] Speaker B: System. [00:18:45] Speaker C: Right. [00:18:46] Speaker B: So now when, when a person is cavalierly looking for a church, guess who's going to come up your name because you have all of this content and if you learn how to use the tools that are available with AI, that, that, that takes the learning curve out of SEO, that takes the learning curve out of title creations, that takes the learning curve out of all of these things. And you can do this nominally. [00:19:09] Speaker A: Right? Right. [00:19:11] Speaker B: You have youth and young adults that's, that's involved in ministry, that's sitting around doing nothing. That's, that's, that's a way to create opportunities for them to impact ministry and then have a skill that they can actually provide for their family. [00:19:24] Speaker A: Well, I thought it was fascinating when you said, you know, the, the tools that you're using for the music, you know, you do utilize that for the media and the digital marketing team. And then that could bring in, you know, that younger person that was on the fence, you know, like, or they would not even think very respectfully. Man, what, how could I be a digital marketing guy and I could go to a church? Like, you know, they don't even equate their skill set with that institution because they're like, I don't fit into that. I'm thinking, you know, a tech hub, I'm thinking a marketing firm. And they're like, no, actually this is going to reach a large swath of people and your skills are going to be in constant need. Because we create content all the time, whether it's going to be vocational schools, whether it's going to be outreach programs, whether it's going to be the choir and everything. And then you have somebody who didn't know their skills were very utilized in that particular institution. [00:20:13] Speaker B: And the problem is too that we have leaders who are not abreast of what's going on around them. So they have these people that may be in a pews and don't know how to use, say, oh, you're going to be a part of our tech team. So the tech team means you're going to video record, you're going to upload, you're going to. They're not really content creating. They're not really sitting down talking about strategies. They're not talking about how to really do the marketing portion. Like for us we've created, which will be also in the fall. Agents, Pathway Back agents. Now this, this is the way my mind views ministry now. Right. So Pathway Back Agent is for Young men and women who are coming home from jail. I grew up in a war against drugs era. I have a lot of friends that have got caught up in the system. Some did 20 plus years or whatever. They're coming home now. Can you imagine what the world looked like 20 years ago? [00:21:07] Speaker A: Oh, night and day, night. [00:21:09] Speaker B: So their pathway, the agent is going to be a mentor in their phone showing them how to do resume. Right. They get a lot of that stuff when they're on the way home. But we all know in learning things have to be reinforced, correct? Correct. So in the agent they, they'll have a personal mentor. And this is what I'm talking about the difference between automation and AI. Over the course of time with AI, the agent gets to know you know how you misspell, know your idiosyncrasies, understand your writing ways and it adapts to you and it helps you to become better. [00:21:45] Speaker A: Right. [00:21:45] Speaker B: So you'll be able to type in your zip code from whatever state you're in and find employment that are lean towards men with and women with records. [00:21:55] Speaker C: Right. [00:21:55] Speaker B: Help mental facilities. [00:21:57] Speaker C: Right. [00:21:58] Speaker B: Help you to go through the process of getting all of the resources that may be available to you that you may not know about and being back. [00:22:04] Speaker A: To functioning member of society and get to back. [00:22:07] Speaker B: But here's the, here's the thing about the agent that that is, that is it has morning affirmations, meditations in every religious context, even for, for those who may be atheists. Because my thing is not to push my religious viewpoint. My thing is to be an asset to the world. [00:22:24] Speaker A: For sure, for sure, for sure. [00:22:26] Speaker B: And we have all of these things built into the agency and yesterday we just got through a meeting where we're going to now help them that's going to be a part and it help them to tell their story so that they can now have a pathway back to go back into the communities and tell their story and help young men and women that may be on the same path to show them that this is not the path. So it's the entrepreneurial path. And once we created that agent, I'm like oh man, veterans coming home and the big beautiful bill passed. And I'm like there's going to be millions of people that, that are going to have to be go back to work. So we have from one thought we created various agents that speak specifically to those needs. This is where people get messed up and here's my marketing hat, they'll create one agent and try to speak to. [00:23:18] Speaker A: All of those needs instead of specifically Per person. Right. [00:23:21] Speaker B: And this is going to be very specific. So the language model for the reentry for a person that was incarcerated, the, the language model for the veteran that's coming home, the language model for someone who just sat on the couch for the last 20 years collecting Social Security or whatever they was doing. They're all different language models and they're going to meet them where they are. And we have one for entrepreneurs too, where we are doing email challenging challenges, funnel building, and sections on how to utilize AI for the business. [00:23:55] Speaker A: Well, I think what's fascinating is that when you get into this podcast space, you learn real quick that there are processes that you need to automate. And, you know, you know, anybody who thinks that they could just slap a microphone and get a pair of headsets on and start, you know, babbling and thinking that people are going to come, you're in for a wake up call. [00:24:14] Speaker C: Right? [00:24:15] Speaker A: You really are. And so I think that the embracing of technology as a utilized tool to free up time, to do things better is certainly something that people should be more embracing because at the end of the day, there's nothing we can do about what's coming down the pipeline. [00:24:28] Speaker B: No, all we can do is prepare ourselves and, and be a leading voice in what's coming down. And that's, that's what if, if you get nothing else from our conversation and you're listening to me, I'm saying to you that there's an opportunity for anyone. The thing about AI is it doesn't look at color, doesn't look at how much money you have. [00:24:47] Speaker C: Right. [00:24:47] Speaker B: All it does is give you back. [00:24:49] Speaker A: What you prompted for real. [00:24:53] Speaker B: And there's, there's, there's, there's an opportunity for young men, young women, older men and older women who have dreams and have big creative ideas to take that creation to a whole nother level and to change your financial future for sure. [00:25:08] Speaker A: And so I always ask everybody this, you know, they never need me to find out where people are. But I say this for the purpose of the show. Where can people find Neuron Tillman? [00:25:16] Speaker B: Nevin Durant said Google my name. Now. Our podcast is called Walking Victory. Our website is Walking Victory. Me. Yeah, we're still under construction. It'll be completed and then we have our pathway back agent, which all of that stuff is going to be on the website. So Walking Victory. And again, if you just Google my name, I'm on all social media handles. Some, some of them, like on Facebook is Walking Victory. On Instagram is Walking Victory. But on TikTok and all of those is just my name because on TikTok I didn't want to have separate handles. So I, I put the content from ministry and the content from my podcast all under just my name. Same thing with Twitter, just my name. But on Instagram and Facebook, I segment the audience. You have the church stuff, which is one ministries network, and, and the walk in victory stuff. [00:26:09] Speaker A: Well, I, I gotta tell you, you know, I would have never, prior to this, and I say this respectfully, of course, put AI and ministry in the same sentence. Right. It just would have never like, you know, I would have said, you know, how does he bridge that gap and that divide? And you do it so well and you realize that you either get on board or you don't. And you've always been an entrepreneur your entire life, so constantly evolving is obviously a part of your DNA. And so it's been an honor and a pleasure to be able to interview you and I would love to have a follow up conversation because I think there's more to you than just a 30 minute conversation. [00:26:39] Speaker B: Sure. And I'm welcome to that. And I thank you for taking out the time and carving out the time of your busy schedule to sit down and talk with me. [00:26:48] Speaker A: I appreciate you very much. Naran Tillman. Thank you so much and wish you nothing but continued success. Well, outside of the.